Palette Tutorial Feeback

[Bruce]

Thank you for the tutorial.
I have been having this issue:
Some of the special effects sprites that I extracted from the mugen characters on the Fighter Factory program have different indexed colors (palettes).
They are in sets, so I don't know why they are in different palettes like that in Mugen.
For example,
The explosion effect set has sprites from 1 through 50, and alot of them contain different palettes (indexed colors) instead of 1 palette.
Because of that, when I tried to convert them all to 1 single palette, alot of them sprites don't look the same as before, and they look uglier instead.
How can I convert them all to 1 single palette without changing their appearance (colors)?
Thank you so much

 

[O Ilusionista]

Some of the special effects sprites that I extracted from the mugen characters on the Fighter Factory program have different indexed colors (palettes).
They are in sets, so I don't know why they are in different palettes like that in Mugen.

Because in Mugen we don't need to use the same palette for everything - and this an old change, since we moved from DOS to WIndows.
So depending on how much colors you have on your character and effects, it will be borderline impossible to make one palette with all colors.

Unless really needed, you don't need to use the same palette for your character and effects - they can have their own palettes.

 

[Bruce]

Because in Mugen we don't need to use the same palette for everything - and this an old change, since we moved from DOS to WIndows.
So depending on how much colors you have on your character and effects, it will be borderline impossible to make one palette with all colors.

Unless really needed, you don't need to use the same palette for your character and effects - they can have their own palettes.

Sorry for the confusion, my question was referring to the Openbor engine, thank you.

 

[O Ilusionista]

my question was referring to the Openbor engine

But you don't need to use the same palette for your character and its effects on OpenBOR too.

 

[DCurrent]

Split off from original topic.

 

[Digital Brilliance Hour]

Thanks @DCurrent! Hey @Bruce the best workaround for this is to create models for all the FX, and simply set the palette of that model to "none"

So:

palette none

Can be used as an attribute to ensure that special effects use their own palette instead of character model that's launching them.
I think it was Andrew Thatcher who told me about that, and it's super helpful!

 

[O Ilusionista]

Can be used as an attribute to ensure that special effects use their own palette instead of character model that's launching them.
I think it was Andrew Thatcher who told me about that, and it's super helpful!

Actually, no.

Palette none will make the engine to load each sprite sprite palette as a palette into the memory. Ok, they are kinda small (768kb) , but this should not be used on an entity because even small, its still a waste of resource.

The special effect can use its own palette, its not a problem. I recomend you make a single image with all the sprites and create a palette from that
(you can use Fighter Factory for that if you want Palettes, the easy way )

 

[DCurrent]

@Digital Brilliance Hour, @Bruce

Listen to @O Ilusionista and stay away from palette none. It's not just the memory, in fact that's not even the main problem. Palette none is meant for very special uses. Basically, if you have to ask what it's for, then leave it alone. Otherwise you're just begging for lots of uneeded complexities, hidden issues, gotchas, and headaches.

Also, you need to find a better source of info. Out of professionalism I'm not going to elaborate much, so put simply, whatever Andrew Thatcher says - do the opposite of that.

DC

 

[Digital Brilliance Hour]

@DCurrent and @O Ilusionista
I didn't realize so much came with that. Honestly, when I heard about it, I had those concerns about how it handled memory, but I think for the small things I used it for, it didn't really hinder things.

I know for now though, yeah I'm fine with making a palette for each spritesheet like before then. And I won't ask haha

Yeah I've only really chatted with him once on one of my videos. But totally understand.
I didn't know Fighter Factory had a way to make an overall palette for a group of images. Definitely gonna use that!

And qq then. The bottom right color on Fighter Factory is considered index 0 for the palette right? or does the palette need to be inverted for that color to be considered index 0?

 

[Bruce]

Sorry if I am off topic DCurrent.
I think everyone misunderstood my question
I already knew that the special effect sets don't need to have the same palette as the character palette and I have no issues with it all.

I had some special effect sprites that I extracted from Mugen character.
for example, explosion sprite set from FX01 through FX50 to make 1 animation, but for some reasons each FX sprite has its own palette.
Basically, the total of 50 palettes out of these 50 FX sprites. Because of that, they looked uglier after I converted them all to a single palette.
My question was how do I convert these 50 FX sprites into a single palette without losing its colors/quality?
I hope it makes sense now.

 

[Kratus]

Sorry if I am off topic DCurrent.
I think everyone misunderstood my question
I already knew that the special effect sets don't need to have the same palette as the character palette and I have no issues with it all.

I had some special effect sprites that I extracted from Mugen character.
for example, explosion sprite set from FX01 through FX50 to make 1 animation, but for some reasons each FX sprite has its own palette.
Basically, the total of 50 palettes out of these 50 FX sprites. Because of that, they looked uglier after I converted them all to a single palette.
My question was how do I convert these 50 FX sprites into a single palette without losing its colors/quality?
I hope it makes sense now.

@Bruce
In case the total number of different colors in all 50 sprites are higher than 256 (in which is the indexed palette limit), certainly you will lose quality during this conversion.

I suggest using the StitchStudio to create a unique sprite sheet using all your sprites and then turn it into an indexed image type using Gimp.
After that, move the transparent color to the first position (using Gimp too) and then apply it to all other sprites using PalApply v2.

 

[O Ilusionista]

Basically, the total of 50 palettes out of these 50 FX sprites. Because of that, they looked uglier after I converted them all to a single palette.
My question was how do I convert these 50 FX sprites into a single palette without losing its colors/quality?

No, I got it right and I was trying to explain it to you
If you have 50 sprites and each one have a different palette, you will loose quality no matter what, because a palette image has a limit of 256 colors.
As I mentioned before, you can use this tutorial to create a single palette from all those images Palettes, the easy way

But I am don't see a reason for you to use a single palette for 50 sprites, really.
On this case - and in this case only - you could use "palette none" and have an entity which will load the palette from each sprite.

 

[Bruce]

No, I got it right and I was trying to explain it to you
If you have 50 sprites and each one have a different palette, you will loose quality no matter what, because a palette image has a limit of 256 colors.
As I mentioned before, you can use this tutorial to create a single palette from all those images Palettes, the easy way

But I am don't see a reason for you to use a single palette for 50 sprites, really.
On this case - and in this case only - you could use "palette none" and have an entity which will load the palette from each sprite.

Great, I will try the "Palettes, the easy way" and see how it goes.
I would rather not to use the "palette none" as DCurrent mentioned it would cause problems and heachaches later.
Thank you for your help.

 

[DCurrent]

@Bruce,

If you truly have a single model comprised of 50 disparate and necessarily unique pallettes, then that would indeed be a valid use for palette none. The problem is that situation is extraordinary rare, because it's effectively an interactive video clip. It is far more likely there's a fundamental problem upstream in your work flow.

Please outline exactly what the end goal is, and we can help you work it out using the right tools and techniques.

DC

 

[Bruce]

@Bruce,

If you truly have a single model comprised of 50 disparate and necessarily unique pallettes, then that would indeed be a valid use for palette none. The problem is that situation is extraordinary rare, because it's effectively an interactive video clip. It is far more likely there's a fundamental problem upstream in your work flow.

Please outline exactly what the end goal is, and we can help you work it out using the right tools and techniques.

DC

I have tried Palettes, the easy way yesterday and the result was better than the method I used before.
I have not tried Stitch Studio method yet. This method is more work, but I think the result would be better since all sprites are combined into 1 sheet, so
I will try this method when I have a chance. Even though palette none may not give me any issues right now, but I prefer not to use it because these are not the only sprites that are like this. If there is a chance that may cause problems later, I stay away from it
Thank you everyone for your help, and god bless you all!